"Ripple Effect: The Battle from Violence to Victory" w/ Mike Petrovic

On this podcast interview we take the show on the road to Gary, Indiana and record an interview with Mike Petrovic at "Restoration House Ministries." This is a compelling narrative  of transformation and redemption through faith. He shares his harrowing journey from a life steeped in crime and addiction to finding purpose, love, and redemption through a true spiritual awakening. Michael's story, set against the backdrop of East Chicago, Indiana, unfolds from a troubled childhood and gang involvement to profound personal change facilitated by his reconnection with Daniel Rivera, a former gang member turned pastor. Mike discusses the significant roles love, forgiveness, and faith played in his transformative journey, emphasizing the role of expressing emotions and the importance of faith-based community initiatives in rehabilitating lives. His story underlines the power of divine love in breaking cycles of violence and addiction, showcasing the potential for personal renewal and societal change through spiritual commitment and community collaboration. 

https://www.restorationhousegary.com/

Transcript

0:02

Um, Uh, Uh,

Omar: 0:15

hello everyone. And welcome to another episode of wrong to strong Chicago. I'm your host. My name is Omar Calvillo. And tonight I have my guests, Michael Petrovic, uh, and we're out here at restoration house. I tried to write it on the board over here. But it's called a restoration house out here in Gary, Indiana. So this is barely my second podcast. I like to call it on the road, you know? So this is wrong to strong Chicago on the road. Uh, so the reason I'm here is, uh, through, through a brother. Uh, I met this brother back in, uh, 2008 his name is, uh, Daniel Rivera. Uh, so back then I was coming out to church out here in East Chicago, Indiana. Uh, brother Daniel had was just recently released from prison back then. Uh, we connected, we met there, talked in church, and uh, years later, I reconnected once again, I don't know how many years that is. Uh, but he reached out to me probably about a month and a half ago. He told me what he's doing out here. They're out out here. Maybe I'll let the brother, you know, share a little bit of what's going on here, but they're all helping the community, helping men, uh, restore their lives. You know, like we were talking about earlier, you know, from the inside out and letting God do the work. Uh, but they're out here doing a great work. So I drove all the way out here, you know, from Chicago, our drive out here. And, uh, man, I'm excited to be here. I'm excited to get my brother's testimony out there. Uh, I know he's excited to share it. So man, Hey, welcome to the podcast, brother.

Mike: 1:37

Thank you, my brother.

Omar: 1:38

You want to share a little bit of what exactly like happens here? You know, at this place,

Mike: 1:42

Okay. At the restoration house, it is a, um, it's a home. It's a, it's a program. It's a program. It's not a shelter. It's not a place where it's, it is for people That's a halfway house or anything like that. It's a program that is designed to direct you to Jesus Christ. It's filled with the Holy Spirit. God is, has his hand on this place. Um, he protects it. He guides it. He, he, Keeps the good individuals coming here, um, to serve. We serve the community we, uh, so any type of identity that we may have on the streets that gets broken down by holding signs out here, serving the community free lunch, and that gives, that gives us an opportunity to really, to give back because that's what Jesus is all about. He's about giving, he's about serving. And, and that's what this program does. This program allows men. To foc, to, to focus and restore reform themselves. Let God work through them to reform them into productive members of society. Be to become the fathers that they were, didn't know how to be, to be free of drug addiction, to be free of gang life, to have a direction, to have focus, to. Um. Serve to, to be disciples of Jesus Christ.

Omar: 3:10

Christ. Amen. Amen, brother. Thanks for that. And, uh, eventually we're going to share how you ended up here. You know how you got here. We, we, we got a story to tell, but man, we, we like to start at the beginning. Uh, so if you could tell us, man, well, where did you grow up at? You know, maybe you moved around from place to place, but like maybe your early years, where, you know, you could remember a place and if you can name that, uh, city, that community. And if you could describe it for the people that they've never been there, you know

Mike: 3:35

Okay, um, I was born November 1st, 1974 in Berwyn. Um, that, that relationship, how my mother and father came together, that was, that was a bad experience. And, uh, My mother ended up, long story short, my mother ended up living in an abandoned house in, in 55th and Claremont in South Chicago. And she was stealing baby food while pregnant with my sister, just to feed us. So, uh, a friend introduced her to, uh, my stepfather. Which, um, was the worst alcoholic and drug addict and violent individual. That you would care to know or be around. And, um, my mom was kind of forced into that situation just to get us off the, off the streets, out of the abandoned house. And, um, that was, that was a start of a very hard, long grooming process to be a violent person that I ended up becoming.

Omar: 4:43

You, you, you want to, um, man, I know that that's rough, but, uh, it's tough because either being in an abandoned home or go stay with this individual is like choosing between like wrong and wrong. I had a brother was on there. It's not between the right choice and the wrong choice. It's like, but it's a little better, man. So I don't know how much of that experience you want to share. Some of the things that were happening at home that maybe, uh, affected you, you

Mike: 5:08

It's very important because, um, my stepfather He came home drunk every night, he destroyed the house every single night, he beat my mom, he would even beat the dogs. And that happened every single night. So, that was, there was extreme fear, extreme display of violence. Led to the police called and then a lady officer coming and consoling. So that became a custom thing every night. So it went from fear. To comfort, to, to attention from a nice lady police officer. So, as a child in that developing stage, I synapsed the two together. Like, it went from fear to comfort, fear to comfort, but stemming from violence. So I learned how to use violence in everything. How to, how to use it when I needed attention, when I needed comfort, when I needed to speak, when I needed friends, when I needed people to be, uh, uh, boundaries set up and walls put up because I started, I started displaying violence very early at school. And, and I used violence in getting up in the middle of the class and beating some kid For no reason, but I knew that no one would want to be my friend. No one would want to come over to the house. No one would want to hang out. So that was kind of protecting, keeping the home life secret.

Omar: 6:45

you. You don't want nobody to see what was going on or even maybe maybe how the home looked

Mike: 6:51

Right. So I used violence as a social mechanism in every way. Okay, what ended up happening with that is that reputation built. Okay, and then there was times when the reputation builds like that. There was times when you don't want to do violence, but because you have that reputation, you have to kind of feel like you have to live up to that.

Omar: 7:15

like you have to live up to it. I

Mike: 7:22

I was stuck. I was stuck in that. This is a very significant point I'm going to bring up, um, My stepdad used to have friends come over and they used to party and do drugs. One night, uh, My sister was molested when she was still in diapers. And, uh, old were you at the time? We

Omar: 7:56

old were you at the time?

Mike: 7:59

young. And, um, I can't remember the age. It was, she was still in diapers. She's got cystic fibrosis. So, the bed wetting kind of went on until later stages, but wasn't too old. We were still young. And, uh, I remember yelling out to my mom, and she kind of just, she was so mad about my, my, my stepdad having, um, friends over partying, she kind of ignored. So my sister was, uh, crying out, like, can I sleep in your bed? And I was like, no, no, because that wasn't the right thing to do. And after that, the violence just kept on getting more, you know, I kept on lashing out, just beating people, beating people and, uh, I remember one day, matter of fact, the guy never got caught. My stepdad got into a car, tried to run him off the road. He never got caught. So,

Omar: 9:06

So did your stepdad find out about this?

Mike: 9:09

this? Yeah, they knew because when they hurried up, when they heard me and my sister screaming for my mom, they kind of scurried out the door and took off in the car. And my stepdad They came in because we kept screaming for my mom and my dad and he tried to run them off the road and he never got up to them. But here's, here's, here's what happened. I remember one day I was cutting a lawn and um, I said, God, give me the, give me the powers of a vampire so I can never let no one hurt my sister or my family again. I can stop my stepdad, I can, I can have the strength to do that. So I sat there and nothing happened. Okay, so I'm just a kid pushing the lawnmower, cutting the

Omar: 10:03

How old are you around this time? Like

Mike: 10:06

About 8, 10ish. Around there. And, uh, man, I remember at that moment, this is, this is a, this is a point in my life, I said, okay, Satan, give me the powers of a vampire. And I, and I, and I promise I will, I will serve you. I didn't know any better. I didn't know any better, but I thought to me that was, that's what blasphemy meant. So at that point, when I said that to him, I felt like I could not never turn back to God. So I thought that was blasphemy. So in that, I heard a voice in my head that said, okay, Kill every little living thing and you will gain the power through the soul or life force that is from that. So I went around as a kid stomping ants, insects, everything that I came across that was living, I, I killed thinking that I was going to gain power out of And that just snowballed into just this whole. life of violence. And I didn't know anybody. I didn't grow up around. Um, God fearing people was around violence and drugs and alcohol.

Omar: 11:33

And you, you let me ask you this. I know you mentioned God and Satan. So not growing around like the things of God, or how did you know to Call out to God or, or to Satan for, for that matter. I,

Mike: 11:46

Okay, that brings a good point because there was times, fast forwarding a little bit, Pastor Dan asked me, he said, he told me, God is not bound by time. So go back and ask him to take you back to the times where you were broken and there was healing. So at that time, God started revealing the times when he was trying to get my attention. And one of the times was, as I remember as a kid, I used to drive around, ride around in Evergreen Park. That's where I grew up and in the cemetery and there was a little caves with Mary and, and Jesus in them. And, and I would go in there and, and sit with Jesus and Mary in, in the little caves and, and that would be my day. I felt comfortable in that. I felt comfortable in the family that was down the street that was, uh, um, friends of mine that they were church going people and they used to give us Kool Aid and feed us lunches and everything. And I just felt real comfortable. I felt every time I approached the Bible, I would get goosebumps just to touch the Bible. And I knew there was power in that. I knew there was a feeling that I had that, that was just really comforting, really belonging, really embrace. And, and I didn't know exactly what it was, but God revealed those times to me when he was there and I didn't listen. I didn't listen. So I. Knew that there was power. I knew that there was power. I just didn't know

Omar: 13:37

Yeah, I

Mike: 13:38

Abused I didn't know I didn't know the difference between you know, I'm saying what I was doing

Omar: 13:44

So go. Going back. Okay. So you, you, you said that you start hearing that voice. Yeah. You said you start stomping anything. So what, what, what, how, what else does that lead you to do, I guess, as your, like, growing up, like going forward?

Mike: 13:56

Well, every, every, the fighting got worse. I, uh, I crippled my hand fighting. And God finally, after, this was after I became saved in 2005 when I was in the penitentiary, fast forwarding. But he revealed to me, he said, you will not hit anybody anymore. You're done with the violence. So he. I couldn't, I can't make a fist now. And, uh, those are just one of the many times God was banging on my shoulder and trying to get me to listen. And I just, I just was so lost. I was so lost, but, uh, continuing on with, with that, uh, um, the childhood. So the reputation built. And that led me to not having a, I didn't have a family life growing up. There was no connection there. There was no love there. So I met some gang members. Okay. Um, each Chicago. And I became a gangster two, six in Chicago and, uh, man, I went really trying to. Prove myself and my nickname that many thousands of people, like mostly penitentiary people know me by the name of loco pastor. Dan knows me by loco. That's what my nickname was. I, I identified with that and I felt like I had to live up to that name

Omar: 15:34

At, at the age of, what did you, uh, join? Like, like

Mike: 15:36

14 years old. So it was in 1988. And, uh, I. Quickly was I was going around and just shooting people, robbing, kicking in doors for pistols and weapons and supplying the organization for that. And, uh, that, that was, that was bad news. I went to, uh, I ended up, uh, committing a crime when I was 18 years old. I, uh, I took somebody's life. For no reason. So, uh, I wasn't angry. It was someone challenged me where my loyalty was. And because this individual wasn't affiliated with what I was affiliated with, I felt his life wasn't worth anything. So, I took his life. And, uh, It's been haunting me ever since. Uh, what ended up happening, which I will get a little bit further down. But that was a, that was a ripple effect. And, uh, I want

Omar: 17:01

know you're in the gangs. Are you like, you know, drinking, getting into all the drugs? How did your life look? Like right before this incident, you know, like, What was the mindset, I guess?

Mike: 17:13

The mindset was local gangster, two, six local, don't mess with me. I was considered a leader. I, uh, had my own little group that I was responsible for and it was the worst of the worst. So it was a pack of us running around, just wreaking havoc on the communities. Just, it was all about violence. It was all about destruction. It wasn't, you know, a lot of drugs are sold and, and stuff like that. But that wasn't my part. My part was if there was a problem, you call local. And, and, and I was too eager to, to, to fulfill that. And, um, that led to me taking somebody's life. And, uh, That's where I met Pastor Dan.

Omar: 18:10

You, you, you want to take us, I know you said you're 18. Maybe take us through the court. You know, how long did you fight the case? When would you finally uh, found guilty I guess?

Mike: 18:19

I fought the case for about a year and a half. Um, there wasn't, my, my very best friend told on me. My childhood friend. He was, he got pulled over on some traffic stops, but Um, You know, I was, I was willing at that point to just accept what I did, you know? And, uh, I didn't plead guilty. I didn't make a statement. I kept my mouth shut the whole time. And the jury was pretty much like, we have a dead body here and this person saying that you did it you're not backing up any kind of story. So I just code of silence on the street. And I just, I went away and I got 43 years in prison, which was pretty much kind of a break because, uh,

Omar: 19:11

now is the the 43, uh, did you have to do 50?

Mike: 19:15

I had to do 50 percent of that. I had to do 50 percent of that. And, um, as soon as I got into the, as soon as that happened, I just started learning. I started, I got my GED. I was still really involved in the gang. Um, Um, stuff actually in leadership positions because there was some young kids that came in with murder cases in the penitentiary and we're all scared. Really when it comes down to it, deep down inside on the exterior, we didn't show it, but inside 18, 19 years old gang, like now we're, now we're, we're grown men in a maximum security prison. Yeah. We had not. Not a something that anyone's quick to jump into.

Omar: 20:00

anyone's quick to jump into. Man, none of

Mike: 20:10

I thought my life was over. I did nothing but cry behind the closed doors. And, uh, I just felt my life was over. My, I was never going to see my family again, none of that. And then it. And it quickly just, it, after that release, it turned to just, you know what I'm saying? Hardened. Just my heart hardened. It had to. It was about survival mode at that point. And uh, it had to. So you know, um, prison life was, uh, um, was not easy. As a young kid and affiliated with a small group. You know the the group that I was involved in we only had a few of them. So we had to act Really the craziest

Omar: 21:07

Now, um, like this gang you mentioned, you, you're talking about East Chicago. So you're in Indiana. This is not Illinois. Now this gang is really big, like in Chicago, Illinois. So I'm sure in the Illinois prisons, I mean, they're everywhere, but you're saying like in Indiana, it wasn't the case, huh?

Mike: 21:23

there was only like three or four of us including pastor dan And They weren't, they weren't really hip to the Latin folks or Latin people or white people that were claiming to be folks or vice or any of them other. So, there's a lot of fighting. You know what I'm saying?

Omar: 21:43

You could ask you something. Cause like in Illinois, a lot of people trip out like, um, like you could be a gang and be different races in Illinois. Like let's say Latin folks, you could be Hispanic, white, black, you know, and vice versa, like, but when I talk to people in other States, it's racial. Like, let's say, even if in the streets, let's say you got a Hispanic, white, black in the streets in the same gang. Okay. Once they hit the penitentiary, like they had a stick by race. Now what's the situation in Indiana prison? How does that look?

Mike: 22:18

It's great. It's segregated. It's segregated. It's, it's now it's really about where your streets are from. So, and it's really about, there's no integrity. There's, it's, it's a lot different from back then. There, there's no, there's no codes. Okay. So if you got a little bit of money, A little bit of commissary, like if you got some drugs, you're in there, you know, so it's, it's,

Omar: 22:44

but how is it in the beginning? Like in those, well, what years were this? Uh,

Mike: 22:48

1990. So the, okay. The difference was, is the, in the penitentiary then, okay, there, there were criminals, there wasn't dope fiends. Okay. Now the, now the prisons are full of dope fiends. So there was really just criminals and, and people that, um, were still in, in, in Indiana State Prison from the Revolutionary Times. Like, so there was still like, wearing bell bottoms with afros and, so they were still stuck from them days. So there was a completely different mentality. There was only marijuana in there. There wasn't the hard drugs that there is now. Now it's full of the hard drugs. It's just wiping people out. Just, just taking them. And, uh, it was a lot different. It, the organizations were organizations back then. Now it's just about getting high and making a dollar. So it's, it's, it's.

Omar: 23:52

yeah, yeah. So, you're talking about recently because obviously you, you were, we're going to get to that, but you ended up doing a lot of time. But in those early years, you know, what were some of those things? Like you mentioned, there were just a few of you guys. So, how did that look? You know, how did, how did like protecting yourselves or establishing yourselves, you know?

Mike: 24:10

we had to walk with integrity and back then the, from the organizations that we stemmed from, like our laws governed us, like we were them types of, and every single one of us had murder cases and we did not. Take any kind of any type of backlash it like we reacted immediately. So You know, I mean it we we got it we got our respect we had to we had to we had too much time So it was it was another situation where I was like kind of forced into the violence Forced in the display of violence all the time. I could not get out of that cycle That cycle has been destroying me my whole life up until just a year ago. And, uh, God really saved me, like, we'll get to that point. Yes,

Omar: 25:10

yes, definitely.

Mike: 25:11

I always pointed to Jesus. The whole point on this is how Jesus Christ has worked. Finally, after all the rehabs, all the psych units, all the penitentiary time, the only thing that worked was Jesus Christ. Man,

Omar: 25:26

you know, let's go through that. You just mentioned like a lot of things that you went through in there. You want to talk maybe some of the things that stand out to you because how many years total did you end up doing? 27 years. now, obviously that's more than half of what you mentioned earlier, right? So you you want to tell us what happened? Did you end up having to get more time while you were already in

Mike: 25:45

Well, I

Omar: 25:46

did that look?

Mike: 25:47

I, I got out in 2011, I got a bachelor's degree in psychology, I got my schooling in, I got four years time cuts, um, because I'm, I, as a, being the leader in there, I made it mandatory that you had to get your, you had to get your time cuts, your four years time cuts, everyone had to. So the only way to do that was school. So. the group of brothers all got out with college degrees and all got out early. I mean, that's the one thing I could say is none of us got hurt. None of, and we all got out early and they've all got families and everything. I'm the only one that came back, man. Still battling with addiction, still battling with violence.

Omar: 26:31

you're the one, in a sense, pushing them.

Mike: 26:34

the one pushing them. And I came back. And I realized God gave me the revelation. He said, because you never did it for yourself. You never did it for Jesus. You never did it. You never put Jesus in your life and did it for yourself. You was always doing it for everyone else. You made it mandatory for everyone else, but you didn't make it mandatory for yourself.

Omar: 26:55

You know, let me ask you a question. You grew up in this household, obviously very violent. It sounded like maybe not much love and affection there. What made you in a sense, as a leader, it sounds like you're protecting these

Mike: 27:09

Yeah.

Omar: 27:10

You know, where, where, where do you feel that comes from? Even though you were violent, sounds like there was a side of you that wanted to look out for your, for your buddies. You know, like you care for them. I would imagine, you know, how, how, where do you think that came

Mike: 27:21

That came from my stepdad coming home and destroying the house, beating the dogs, beating my mom, like the family, like, and me stepping in. And say, no, no, no, getting the, getting the attention, getting taken on, taking the abuse on me, you know what I'm saying? Like protecting my sister from never letting that situation that happened to her again, like nothing happened to my mom, like, so those were the types of situations that I stepped into them roles. All the time, like, no, you're not gonna hurt. No, you're not gonna hurt'em. You're not gonna hurt'em. Do it to me. Not the dogs. Do it to me. Don't touch my, don't touch my mom, don't touch my sister. Do it to me. So I was always in that role of, come on, I can take it. I can take it. And, uh, so I, I, I suspect. That's where that came from. And just wanting to be a part of a family. Just wanting the love. Just, I'm really a type of guy that's full of love, man. I'm full of love. I'm not a person that's full of hate or anger, you know what I'm saying? Or rage or anything like that. Like, I'm full of love. And, I'm passionate. You know? And, um I guess those were qualities. I guess not having that family and is finding that I wanted to keep it. You know what I'm saying? I wanted to find some type of identity and put love into it. Hold on to it because that became my family.

Omar: 29:03

that, that makes like a, like a lot of sense what you mentioned, man. Like, and you, you did that for your family. Now you brought that with you to the streets, you know, to the group of guys you were with and, and then be behind bars, start doing that, you know, for your guys. And there's no, that makes, that makes sense, man.

Mike: 29:19

And a lot of, a lot of outsiders gravitated outside other organizations, gravitated, and, uh, it was just the love that's displayed. And this is why I say Jesus Christ and the love that he displays is still going on today. It's still going on today. That has an effect way more powerful than. Hitler. I'm not comparing. I don't want to put that in those names together, but I'm saying what he what that that individual did that that stopped right there. Jesus is love and he's displayed is still continuous.

Omar: 29:59

brother. Okay. So, uh, you, you mentioned, you know, you're trying to help your guys. They get out, you ended up going back. What, what, what, happens there that, uh, So how long did you, okay, you said you got out in 2011, I believe. How long did you stay out for? And then what happens that you end up, you know, back behind bars?

Mike: 30:16

Okay, so I paroled to Joliet, Illinois. And I said, I'm never going to go back to Indiana again. So I went to go live with my sister. Well, my sister at that time, she's, she's so she had not surrendered to Jesus Christ. She's, she's discipled with Jesus Christ now.

Omar: 30:36

Oh, today. Okay. Yes. Gotcha.

Mike: 30:38

but she, she didn't surrender. And I wasn't. Surrendered to Jesus. Uh, we believed, but we didn't know how to follow. We didn't know how to walk and just being away from my family for that long. And then going to a living situation with them. We're strangers. We don't know how that is going to turn out to be like when, when, when people split apart and then they try to come back together again. You necessarily don't know each other anymore. And, and that it's like, you depend on your own will, your own strength, your own understanding, when you, when you don't have Jesus in your life, when you don't have God in your life to direct you through that, through establishing relationships, how to navigate through that, we tend to do it by our own. And that doesn't always work. it doesn't always work.

Omar: 31:43

So, at this point in 2011, how long had it been? Or how much time exactly was it from when you got locked up to then?

Mike: 31:51

Okay. So in 2011, me and my sister got into an argument and that didn't work out. Well, the parole officer in Illinois said, you have to go back to Indiana. And my mother was Wasn't, she didn't have her own place. So I had to call on the guys again, and then I called the guys from the penitentiary and was like, Hey man, I need a place to stay. And I'm here. I'm back in the hood in Marktown in Chicago, to go. And, uh, um, here it is falling back on the guys and then got, you know, and, uh, So, still, my addiction, my addiction has been the downfall of my entire life, because regardless of what I believed in, if I'm still hanging on the fence, addicted, and addiction is this, addiction is the need to Do something or consume something to feel differently than how I do now. It doesn't matter the substance. You could be addicted to violence, TV, whatever, but it's the need to do something to feel differently than I do right now. And that mindset I couldn't get out of. I, I was always needing to feel differently than how I do now because how I feel now. I hated myself. I didn't want to live. I lived a reckless life that was suicidal. You know, I tried to commit suicide. I got scars up and down my arms. You know, that just happened a year ago.

Omar: 33:43

Oh, no way.

Mike: 33:45

Yeah. that just happened a year ago in Westville when I was, uh, I completely gave up and God kept pulling me through. He kept pulling me out of these situations when I wasn't even looking to him. I wasn't even asking for him and he kept pulling me out. And it was them finally these times that I don't want to get too far forward,

Omar: 34:08

right, right.

Mike: 34:09

But yeah, there was that, that was another time. And I went back into penitentiary and this time I couldn't go back in being the loco because I was on a parole violation and a write up could set you. And I was facing a lot of backup time. So I said, I, I went back for a drug overdose. I, uh, in Chicago Heights, somebody, uh, shot me up with some heroin and it was too much cause he wanted to rob me. And he wiped me down and I woke up in the ambulance and I didn't tell my parole officer about it. I had six months left to go on my parole and wound up back in the penitentiary again and did another six years. And I couldn't be the same person that I had just left because I had too much backup time. And I wanted to get back out onto the streets because I had a taste of life.

Omar: 35:09

of life. What does that mean, backup time? What do you mean by that?

Mike: 35:13

Backup time is if 43 years, you do 21 years, you do half that time. So now there's 21 years left out of the 43. That's time that they can take away from you. That's your backup, like that's the time that you can, that they stack onto you and they can make you serve. That's your backup time. So.

Omar: 35:39

keep getting in trouble catching stuff, you could be possibly doing all the

Mike: 35:45

All of it. Yeah, got it. And I was just faced with that. With the outdate of 2036.

Omar: 35:51

Wow. So, okay, so you're, you're back in there, you know, the overdose, but what begins to happen in there? Like,

Mike: 35:58

Okay. So when I went back in, um, I had to completely be in a submissive posture, which where I just left from, they weren't used to that. They weren't used to the loco that they were used to. So I had to constantly be into a type of submissive posture, worried about the next, worried about getting a write ups and the kind of scary, what people call scary.

Omar: 36:26

Now this is for you not getting in trouble with the officers

Mike: 36:29

the

Omar: 36:30

what you mean like getting any write ups you mean like Doing anything that they, that you're not obeying, I guess.

Mike: 36:36

Right, right. So in living that way for six years, I came out, okay. I finally got released

Omar: 36:45

what, what, what, what year was this?

Mike: 36:47

um, 2019. Okay. So. Then I just kind of went with the flow what everyone told me to do. Okay. Okay. Okay, you know I'm saying and Still I wasn't doing things for the I didn't have Jesus in my life. First of all, I didn't have God in my life I wasn't I believed that there was a God but I didn't believe in God to where every day I walked with him

Omar: 37:16

Yeah.

Mike: 37:17

There's a difference there. So In that, I ended up messing with the same crowd. I messed with a girl And man had a dentist. That's a horrible, that there was a horrible experience. I was with this woman for nine years. She ended up sleeping around with everyone at my job. they ended up, um, I ended up threatening, which he was an ex police officer. I ended up threatening his life

Omar: 37:51

the guy's life

Mike: 37:52

yeah, the guy's life. And, uh, at this time I had a change of address warrant out for me. So he said to prostitutes, try to call me for a tattoo because I do tattoos. And really it was just, they kind of, they contacted police and told This warrant and I went back again to prison and this time I went back completely like remembering the last six years that I went back for traveling out of state without permission and that's a technical violation and I went back again for another three years for a change of address and this time I absolutely gave up. I consumed all of it. every single drug that I could. I caught three different stabbing cases inside the penitentiary.

Omar: 38:53

was just you hurting somebody else. Is that what you mean? Okay.

Mike: 38:56

Um, one of them, I was beat into a coma. Five guys jumped me and I was in a coma for 11 days. I was airlifted to critical care in South Bend. Um, I woke up in the infirmary after 11 days of being in a coma and was mad that I didn't die. I was, again, God save, again, the overdose. Then this situation. Matter of fact, let me take you back. The year that, in 2011, when I got out, I died twice that year from bronchospasms and asthma attacks. Twice, I had to be rushed and intubated. To the hospital. Now, I never had that happen to me in my entire life, but I'm understanding now of the spiritual battle that's going on with me and in this spiritual battle, death is happening and in life is being brought back to me. And it's clearly, It's Satan and God just tugging and pulling, tugging and pulling. And it's in that battle where I finally submitted and said, okay, what is it that you want me to do? What is it? You have a purpose that is higher than me. Your thoughts are higher than mine. Like it says in Isaiah, like my, your ways are higher than my ways. So what is it? So it was in that fierce spiritual battle, me trying to commit suicide, bringing me back to about

Omar: 40:36

this. I know you mentioned 2011 died twice, those asthma attacks.

Mike: 40:41

Yeah.

Omar: 40:42

Then what year was it that they beat you into a coma?

Mike: 40:45

That was, um, about a year and a half ago.

Omar: 40:49

Okay. Gotcha. And then when was this after that, the, the trying to kill yourself after

Mike: 40:54

This was before

Omar: 40:56

okay. All right. You, you, you want to take us back to, let's say that this instance, like, what were you thinking, feeling at the time that led you to do this, you know, the

Mike: 41:05

Okay, so, I went to my parole hearing, and I knew they were going to set me, because I was already, I was going in front of them with stabbing cases. And, um, I came back. Now, this parole hearing was different, because I had read an Orthodox, I'm Serbian Orthodox, was baptized when I was younger. So I read an Orthodox book called 12 Steps to Heaven. This book brought an anointing on, like changed me the way I was feeling inside. So when I went to the parole hearing, I told him, I said, you know what? I don't want it. Don't release me because God has something to do. He's got to work on me. I told them that, and they were blown back. Now, this is normally a phone call that I usually make afterwards. They just told me, listen, stay out of trouble. We're going to wipe the slate clean. Come back next year with no write ups. And I said, okay. So I call my mom and I call my sister that day and they can feel the change. I was so happy that, It's usually a phone call where it just wrecks everybody like they took another year for me and my mom She's getting old and my sister's got cystic fibrosis, and she's not well with her health and and it just wrecks everybody This day was completely different. They were crying. We were all crying in happiness in tears because I was really Putting Jesus in my life putting him first So I come, I come back and I'm on the unit and I'm reading my Bible. There's some, uh, Muslims that are not Muslims. They're just, they just identify with that to serve their own agenda.

Omar: 43:04

Yeah.

Mike: 43:05

And, uh, they're making fun of me reading the Bible. So now I'm starting to hear. Plots and voices and stuff going on in my head. And now I'm hearing voices in my head talking about, Take your bunkie out. My bunkie was a satan disciple. And, uh, I couldn't stop the voices going on. Let

Omar: 43:32

Let me ask you this. Were, were these voices happen after you were letting God in your life or was this something that was ongoing prior to you reading those 12 steps to heaven, you know, feeling that anointing, I guess.

Mike: 43:45

Okay. So it was a mixture of being addicted and then hanging on the fence with trying to read scriptures. You can, listen, I don't, do not suggest anyone to hang on the fence like that because You can let in voices and stuff that, that in your head that is not of God, that are data, demonic voices. You cannot, the fence is Satan. You cannot straddle the fence. You have to choose one way or another. You cannot be actively addicted to drugs and alcohol, whatever, and then still try to be serving Jesus Christ. Because for me, at least, I'm speaking for me.

Omar: 44:36

Yeah

Mike: 44:38

You can get twisted in your thoughts, and that's exactly what happened. So, um, the voices and then mixed with drug usage. And I said, man, I cannot hurt nobody else. So I tried to take my life. I, I couldn't, I couldn't deal with it. So I cut my arms wide open and I went to go cut my neck and a gangster disciple. He's high ranking, tackled me on the ground. He was like, no, local don't. And

Omar: 45:11

what was this happening at? What were you at now? Were you on the, on the deck? Were you in your

Mike: 45:16

was, I was on a deck.

Omar: 45:17

Okay. Were you loud in the open

Mike: 45:18

Yeah. Cause it's like a dorm setting. There's

Omar: 45:21

Oh, okay. You want to explain that like a

Mike: 45:23

yeah, there's not single man cells. Like there was in, in Indiana state prison, it's a dorm site type setting. So. There's no doors. Like everyone

Omar: 45:34

it like a bunch of bunk beds?

Mike: 45:36

Yeah. Bunks of bunks.

Omar: 45:37

yeah, okay, and it's out in the open, everybody can see each

Mike: 45:40

It's out in the open and it looks tore down. It's like an abandoned it. Everything's torn down. Gotcha. Okay. So it, it's, it's, it's not a good environment and, um, start

Omar: 45:49

doing this and somebody, you said there's a GD that sees

Mike: 45:53

Yeah. Yeah. He, and he tackles me and he said, no, don't. And before I went to cut my throat, so. This is the hard part. So, uh, uh, I get brought down to the infirmary. And, uh, um, Now I'm talking to a captain. Captain, Captain Hurt. And he's a disciple of Jesus Christ. And we're up all night stitching up my arms. And we're talking about Jesus. And we're talking about God. And, uh, um, That's when Really stuff started to hit me. I came bandage up on both my arms back to the unit. And then every single leader, leader of the vice Lords, leader of the Latin King, all the leaders got together and went to the director on that side of. Westville and said, help this man. He is a good man. Help him. He's, he's addicted to drugs. He's, he needs help. So they got me into the RWI program.

Omar: 47:07

Do you want to explain what that is?

Mike: 47:08

Okay. And RWI program is the substance abuse program that they have in there. But, uh, um, I'm going to be honest with you. There wasn't a day that it went without drugs and this is a substance abuse program. There's, there's, there's. Flooded with drugs. So here's another battle and I'm, I'm reading scriptures. I'm doing my prayers and it, I'm fighting hard, man. I'm fighting, I'm fighting this battle hard. And, uh, um, that's when I graduated the program. a, that was a hard fight right there. And, uh, I met Wayne Antousis. That's a, that's a man that, that did 23 years in Illinois prison, man. He was facing life without parole and he did 23 years. He was gang banging in South Chicago and he did 23 years for a crime he didn't do. 23 years serving Jesus Christ, doing Bible studies the whole time. And he got out and, uh, Um, God told him you're going to go back into prisons. You're not done with prison. You're going to go back into them and you're going to bring, you're going to shed light. And he did. He shined some light in Westville and I met him in Westville and a great dear friend of mine. He's a soldier in Christ. A lot of opportunities are happening for Pastor Dan, Wayne Entousis, me, like, um, I do, I do small little, uh, Bible studies on Facebook and man, uh, a man, a disciple of Jesus Christ from Pakistan saw one of, out of all the stuff, of all the nonsense that's on social media, he finds me and then now I'm doing FaceTime with him and the kids in Pakistan. And I'm speaking at conferences with missionaries that are going into war zones.

Omar: 49:13

doing now, but let's, let's transition. Cause at the point of the story, you just graduated the drug program, you know, the guys, man, and this is crazy that you mentioned all these gang leaders, even from opposite gangs trying to help you. So, okay, you graduated the group, uh, drug program. What happens from there that eventually leads you to, to where you're at now, you know, how, how, what, what does that, that timeframe look like

Mike: 49:38

there? and That's how God works. I wasn't even program eligible. I could not get the time cut or get any of the benefits. I was just there because these individuals said, man, help this guy. And I was there struggling, fighting, trying to get this help. And uh, I went, my parole hearing came up and man, by the grace of God, released me and they granted my parole.

Omar: 50:21

Okay, so this was,

Mike: 50:25

happened? Okay, so this was, this was last year. Okay, because I haven't, I've only been out for four months.

Omar: 50:33

Okay. Recent. So what, what, what, what month

Mike: 50:35

So, so this was, this was happening December.

Omar: 50:39

December, 2023. Yes. Gotcha. Okay.

Mike: 50:42

December 2023. So, now here it is. Um, Parole Board and I'm, uh. I said, man, I can't get out and go to the same hood with the same gangs doing the same thing because I'm going to die. I'm going to go back to prison or I'm a, I'm a, I'm a die. If I come back to, I'm a die. So I filled out applications for sober living houses and no one answered back. So now I'm sitting there and I'm two days away from. Um, hitting the streets and I'm already in my mind. I'm thinking, man, I'm just going to get out and do me and hook up with the guys and you hook up with the females and just do me. And then my counselor sends me a posted note. The only place that contacted me back of the applications that I filled out was called restoration house. And I was like, I seen the address on it. It was a Gary and I was like, Oh man, the hood again, man. I can't get out the hood. You know what I'm saying?

Omar: 51:54

That this, uh, this close to where you grew up at.

Mike: 51:56

Yeah. And, uh, um, but the name on it said Daniel Rivera. And I was like, what? So I said, I know. So I used my last phone call and I call up my sister and I said, call this number and ask him if this is the. he doesn't want me to go by his, his old nicknames. I said, ask him if this is that man that I started serving time with. And she said, hold on. And it was, and I said, is that now I thought about this man because we started out our time together. He was 18. I was 19.

Omar: 52:37

Uh, how many, uh, years did you guys end up doing together or?

Mike: 52:40

We did about. seven, eight years

Omar: 52:44

that, that's a, that's a time

Mike: 52:46

Yeah, but, but it was the time period we, we started doing, we faced, we started doing this before we even went to our trials, so we're facing murder trials, gang banging, like young, never been to prison before, and we're on exterior, we're tough guys. Right. No, we're actually scared inside. So it was at that point where we had the most impact on each

Omar: 53:20

each other. Yeah, yeah, because you were still, I think in those years, you were still like, uh, What's the word I'm looking at? Impressionable, moldable kind

Mike: 53:27

seeking for an identity, uncomfortable with, you know, we're not grounded in the man, like who we are.

Omar: 53:34

yeah, no, yeah, yeah. Even like now they're realizing that the brain is still like a, what do you call it? Developing. I believe, uh, I believe they say now to the age of 25, I believe is when they're still like, like, uh, I guess biologically speaking,

Mike: 53:48

Yes. And you, you stunt that growth with alcohol and drug abuse. When it, for the abuse and trauma, you stunt it.

Omar: 53:56

Gotcha. So, okay, going back. Daniel Rivera. That's the only one that, that reaches out, huh?

Mike: 54:02

He's the only one that reaches out. So, and I find out that's him. That's the man that I started doing and I, he's been on my heart because I would follow him in the world and, and I was like, man, I've respected this man on a street level, probably one of the only individuals that I really had that, this kind of love and respect for because he was a different kind of person, man. And, uh, um, here it is. And I said, man, God, if you are not like, if you are not, I don't know. You've saved me out of my life, uh, situations, dying several times. And you've released me coming back, back and forth from prison several But now you are covering me with individuals that are serving in your kingdom. So I said, okay. Okay. I'm going to, I'm, I'm, if you didn't already convince me, we're bringing me back to life. Okay. You convince me now we're putting this man after all these years, I've thought about him and here he is. So I got out, I got, I was released and I went right back into getting drinking, getting high, hanging out with the crowd. And Danny Rivera said, man, Mike's got to pursue me. I'm not going to pursue him. I'm done. He told that to my sister. I

Omar: 55:31

got it. Okay.

Mike: 55:32

And, um,

Omar: 55:34

it was your sister trying to reach out to him, I guess, to get you some help. Okay.

Mike: 55:37

And, uh, uh, I showed up with that man, Wayne Antunes, that did 23 years in Illinois. I said, I made him a promise when he was in Westfield doing, he's had a class, Ten Steps to Christ. And, uh, I said, I'm going to church the first Sunday I'm out. Wow. That's amazing. With my sister and I'm a man of my word. So I showed up to church with my sister that first Sunday. And, uh, he said, guess what we're going to do. I said, what's that? He said, we're going out in the parking lot. We're going to call pastor Dan. So I got nervous because this is, this is saying goodbye. This is saying goodbye. I'm going to follow a pastor. Dan, you know what I'm saying? Like, cause I respect this man, I respected him on the streets and I haven't seen him in. Over 20 years. So I'm nervous. And he said, Mike, I happen to be driving down the street. And, like I said, God does not, our God is not about coincidence or circumstance or mistakes. He doesn't work like that. So, here it is. My, Daniel Rivera pulls up in the car. Now he is a pastor and he is the minister over restoration house that saves men's lives Puts him on a path Jesus Christ's path to serve his purpose and his will and Here he is standing in front of me after 23 years man and and and If that is just not one of the many things God has, has, has exemplified what he has shown, you know, saving, saving your life or whatever. They, people can argue it like, but there's too many incidences that I haven't seen this man in 23 years. And now he's a pastor standing in front of me and we were gangbanging, beating people up, hurting people, selling drugs. 20 some years ago. Now he's talking about, man, Mike, you're going to serve Jesus Christ. And I'm going to show you, I'm going to guide you. I'm going to be the earthly, uh, accountability individual in your life that God has put me in your life. He's put us together and man, Easter Sunday, guess who baptized me? Pastor Dan. So all these years, like. Here's an individual I gang bang with now. He's baptizing me at the crossing church on Easter and not only that my sister's there and Darlene is a great lady of God Baptizing my sister and not only that in Arizona where my family Jaime Casares a pastor out there And my great niece, my great nephew, Miranda, his wife is all getting baptized at the same time. And we didn't even know this was going on. We got pictures of it up. We put it on. We didn't even know that we were all doing this at the same time.

Omar: 58:52

Holy, holy God, man. Praise God, man. That's, that's amazing.

Mike: 58:58

it is, I just, it's just one of the many, many, many things that's happening. Uh, That's happening in my life that I would never, I would, I would never be sitting here talking to you, brother. If it wasn't for me saying, God, okay, I'm going to do your will and do your purpose. I'm a soldier up. I did so long for the streets. I did so much stuff for the streets. I'm going to give my time to you now. And this is one of the things. Uh, Nicky Gracious. I don't know if you know him. Like, he's a, he's a very good He's a famous, uh, Christian rap artist. He used to be a maniac Latin disciple. I served 10 years with him in prison. One of my closest friends now. And, uh, we stay in contact. He's, he's serving the kingdom. Uh, Brian T. Are you up to Brian T.?

Omar: 1:00:00

Oh, is it a brain trejo? Yeah. Okay. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah at

Mike: 1:00:03

very, very close with my family. In Arizona, I just went to a spiritual event down there with him. Yeah. So these are all now individuals. I'm starting to see these individuals that. Serve the world did all this gangbanging, all this drug dealing, all this, this hurt, all this stuff, and now serving Christ and, and making an impact. Because guess what? The, the, the Christians, the disciples of Christ doesn't necessarily look like the suit and tie individuals. They look like us. They look like us. And boy, we are making an impact. Of serving Jesus Christ and directing people to just look to him. That's all, that's all I can do. No, I can't. I can only help people to look to him. And, uh,

Omar: 1:01:03

know what, there's something to be said about that, man. Because, uh, All the, some of the qualities that you mentioned earlier, like when you were talking about that love, that dedication, that commitment to protect, man, one, once God grabs a hold of those same qualities that, that I believe the enemy corrupts, he twists, but God says, nah, we're going to keep all that, but not like you mentioned, soldiering up, you soldiered up for the streets for whatever gang said you were in. I want that same commitment. That same, you mentioned a word earlier. I think you were passionate.

Mike: 1:01:38

Yeah,

Omar: 1:01:39

You were passionate for those things.

Mike: 1:01:41

Omar,

Omar: 1:01:42

yeah. Go ahead, brother.

Mike: 1:01:43

uh, to exclamation point and this is how God works. The revelation that God put on me. He said, uh, uh, I allowed you to get trained in the world by Satan and all the things to go without. To be hungry, to be that soldier, because I knew that one day you were going to turn to me and you was going to already possess all them qualities. And I was like, Ooh, man, it impacted me. Like, wow. Okay. I, I get it. I get it. So, yeah. Uh, um, what, what same thought that he had. A good soldier in doing him. No, no, those qualities, those qualities are now serving Christ. And, and, and man, I am so grateful for every day, every day that I wake up. I am so, man, there's things that's unfolding in my life that, that I, uh, is like not quite unfolded yet, but it's just.

Omar: 1:02:52

getting, uh,

Mike: 1:02:54

getting, I'm, I'm getting glimpses of it. Uh, now people are just been telling me you're, you're knowing you got something going on. You got some special, I cannot wait to see what's going on. And it's coming. It's only because I served Jesus Christ because I'd never meet these people. It's only because I'm free from my drug addiction. It's only because I'm not gang banging anymore and all the other stuff. It's only because I am now walking the path. And walking with Jesus every day that these things are coming into my life and they are coming They are coming as as i'm responsible for them I know that god says listen I'm, not going to give you a job right now. That's going to give you a whole bunch of money I'm, not going to bless you because you'll ruin yourself with it

Omar: 1:03:46

Gotcha.

Mike: 1:03:47

You I so That that keeps me obedient You That keeps me respecting the obedience, respecting the boundaries, respecting God's timing, like respecting God, the people that God puts in my life to hold me accountable, you know what I'm saying? The Holy Spirit to dwell within me, to convict me of the things that, that, that I may be doing wrong. It starts with our thoughts, starts with my thoughts. You know what I'm saying? So in staying obedient. And seeing these blessings coming, you want to stay, I want to stay more obedient. I want to stay, Hey, okay. Like I'm not going to try to micromanage your control. None of this because Jesus, I give it up to you and you are showing me every step of the way, every step of the way. I listen, I don't have violence in my heart anymore. I'm not angry anymore. I don't want to, I don't Lash out to people and my desires have completely changed. My desires have completely changed. I don't glorify any, all the stuff that you, I used to glorify, man, I don't glorify none of that anymore. I glorify marriage. I glorify a family. I glorify serving the communities. I glorify man, the people like me that look like me, that look like you. Becoming grateful servants, Jesus Christ, and giving back. And, and I look forward to that every day now that I wake up. I can't wait for the next one. Because opportunities, they just, it just comes in abundance. It just comes in abundance and it's just the beginning. It's just the beginning, Omar.

Omar: 1:05:35

Amen.

Mike: 1:05:35

It's just the beginning and I just, man. I, I promise I, I, I plead with anybody that's out there, like, listen, surrender, surrender, surrender, surrender, submit to Jesus Christ, allow him to show you how to live, show you how to think, show you how to, how to act, show you how to love. Because that's, I didn't know how to love. I didn't really know how to love until Jesus Christ showed me how to love. I didn't know how to forgive. I didn't know what peace was about until I learned what forgiveness was about. Forgiveness gives me peace. It gives me the calmness. Calling on the Holy Spirit to dwell within me. You can't leave. Listen, drugs were created to kind of like replace God. Replace the Holy Spirit. Like, so I promise it's, I promise. I said that to say this, when you invite the Holy Spirit in, don't need that alcohol. You don't need them drugs. You don't need the things that you did that run, run out. That runs out. The alcohol runs out. The drugs run out. The money runs out. The chasing after females that all runs out. Jesus Christ does not run out. The Holy Spirit does not run out rich in that mercy and forgiveness and love rich in it. And I I'm just speaking out of testimony, like period. I am, I am free from all the things that held me in prison. And let me tell you something. You don't have to be behind bars to be in prison. You don't have to be behind bars. There's many people out there that's in prison. And, and, and now my passion is, is to direct you, to free you from that.

Omar: 1:07:44

What are some of these things that are keeping people in prison? While they're out here, you know, free in a sense in the world, but still a captive

Mike: 1:07:53

Addiction is number one. The use of alcohol and substances is number one. Trying to seek an identity is another one. You can get locked in, in trying to be something that you think is, is prosperous. That you think gives you street credit or that you think that gives you strength. That's all false. That's all lies that the devil uses to twist, and that's how he works. Devil's not some red figure that comes from the concrete with a pitchfork and the ground cracks open. It's the, he manipulates the thoughts and, and, and, and, and implants lies in your head. At least that's how he works with me. I, I can't, I'm not gonna speak for everyone, but. And lies and tells you that you're not worth it. Shame and embarrassment and, and regret and anger and all those things that are not of God, those things aren't of God. Those things are of, of darkness. And I want people to shed the light. Share the light, bring the light in the darkness. You know what I'm saying? And that's Jesus Christ. That's Jesus

Omar: 1:09:17

all that. You know, one thing that came to my mind, you mentioned a lot of things, but you mentioned peace, something that you never knew. Now, forgiveness was another word that stood out. How hard or easy was it for you to forgive? Cause like going back to the beginning of your story, there was a lot of hurt. A lot of trauma. I'm sure you had plenty of unforgiveness towards a lot of people. Now once the Holy Spirit came, once God starts working, how easy or hard was it for you to forgive? And then what did you experience when you truly forgave?

Mike: 1:09:51

Okay. So let me tell you, let me take it. And this is a perfect window. The, the unforgiveness came about me. Okay. That. Held me captive for the up until recently and I'll share that, but, um, and it was because the individual, the victim on my case, his brother became, got a letter about the year I was getting out in about 2010. And it was from the victim's brother and he said, I am the brother of so and so and I just want you to know, um, I forgive you. And he gave me some Bible verses and he told me, he said, but I want you to know what the family went through. And he said, uh, our mother left her home and lived in Walmart parking lot. And. She stayed in her car for a year and a half until the psych unit had to remove her. So he was like, there was an issue between him and my, our mother that will never be resolved. And, uh, he's like, I became a police officer where you dumped my, my, uh, brother's body. And he said, I used your face to arrest every. Child molester, rapist, burglar. He went all the way down the line. He said, until I became number one police officer. And he said, then I became detective and I used your face on every child rapist. And he went all the way down the line. He said, I came head detective until one day I fell to my knees and I said, Lord, forgive me for I locked up so many innocent men using this man's face. And man, it hit me right there. And I said, dang, man, that split second of me turning that pistol and shooting that person had a ripple effect to still that's still going on. It's still going on that. So many families were destroyed. This man went on a vengeance, locking innocent men up that police department. And this is what the Holy Spirit revelation came to me. I said, damn, that attitude that that individual had in that police department, it was in Harvey. That police department had a ripple effect amongst the other officers and they had that effect on the rest of the community. So what was bothering him had an effect on the other police officers, which had an effect on the community. And he was, they were all locking now corruption. If anybody knows about the Harvey police department, big corruption happened in there, they had to have federal FBI come in to do the work for police officers. There are a lot of police officers got in trouble. So. Many innocent people. And then he said, Finally, I fell to my knees and I said, Lord, forgive me for I locked up for many innocent men using this man's face and he quit his job. So fast forward to a men's encounter that is at Living Stones Church. Now, this is a group of about 300 men that spend the night at the church and it's a three day press into the Lord. Uh, event that goes on. So they separate us and break us into groups. So, like I said, our God is not by circumstances, our coincidence. So I'm sitting next to a Cook County police officer in my group. And it's only like nine guys. And I'm sitting next to another individual from Harvey. And he tells me about his sister almost getting killed. By one of the detectives and that it was possibly the individual that I took his brother's life, but it just confirmed the, the, the revelation that God put in me and said, man, what you did had a ripple effect. It's still going on today. And how many lives, how many attitudes that people had based on the attitude of these officers and how it just kept on, how many lives were destroyed over that split second decision to turn and shoot somebody thinking I was being a tough guy or gangbanger or so whatever like that is still having an effect on Way bigger level than I could ever imagine. And I caused that. So as a soldier that I call myself, it's my responsibility to start doing the good now, because this, what I thought about, I said, if that one split second decision caused this much ripple effect. All these years, imagine if I've been doing good all these years, loving, serving people, doing good, that ripple effect never happened again, Omar. I'll never make that mistake and cause that pain like that with, with people again, because. I thought about all the men that were locked up for innocent, destroyed the families, kids were ripped away from their, their father, financial, like people's, someone's husband was pulled away from somebody's father was pulled away from because a dumb decision I made and took somebody's life in. How that affected my family, like, the ripple effect from a stupid decision Has an effect. It has an effect. It has an effect. And, uh, If you care just a little bit, man, a little bit You think about that, man. You think about that because I don't want to be the reason why men are pulled, ripped away from their homes, away from their kids. You know, I don't want to be that, I'm not that guy, man. These are the things that you think about way down the line. See, people may want to act like tough, like strong, like I'll, I'll shoot you or whatever. Okay. What happens down the line when, when, when, when all the realities start happening of what you did. Tear you up. So back to your question

Omar: 1:17:40

Yeah. Yeah.

Mike: 1:17:42

on forgiveness of myself, it bound me, man. It kept me in prison forever. And, uh, It wasn't until Pastor Dan, when I was telling him, I said, man, how do you, how do you act, how do you get over that you killed somebody? You know what I'm saying? How do you, how do you hold your head up? And I was explaining to him and he stopped me right there. And he said, wait a minute. He said, when that man forgave you, he said, that was the end of it right there. He freed you from that. So be free from that. He said, man, God forgave you. That man forgave you. He said, why'd you keep on throwing it in the God's face? Why'd you keep on reminding him of what he just forgot about? Stop doing that. You know what I'm saying? Because you're going to never press on, but that's what Satan does. That's what the devil does. He will keep that in your mind and, and keep you in prison because what he wants to happen is for you to die. Not following Jesus Christ, not being a soldier, not serving Jesus Christ. He wants you to die in the darkness take your soul.

Omar: 1:19:00

all that brother and man like here I was thinking forgiveness like for the family and everything that you experience that you witness, but ourselves man is a lot of times like it's easy to even extend forgiveness to others for what they've done to us, but We want to accuse in a sense ourselves, I know the enemy accuses of Satan, you know, he's the accuser of the brethren, but I feel sometimes like us, like we can't receive that forgiveness from God that easily, even though man, Jesus went on the cross and died for all of our sins for all of them. It could be from somebody telling a little white lie to. To murder the taking of somebody's life, but there's something about us almost like, man, I, I gotta, I gotta do something to earn the forgiveness. I gotta, I gotta give back, but no, he already did it all, man. And like he mentioned, you know, Jesus forgave us, you know, God, the father forgives us through the atoning sacrifice of his son. The man for forgave you the brother, you know, and, uh, and sharing everything that the ripple effect, man. But now here's the thing too. Now, like that's the ripple effect from a bad action. But. What's the ripple effect from a man that surrenders his life to Jesus Christ and the effect that is going to have not only around those around them, but the generations that are to come and that's going to be a greater impact. You know what I'm saying? Like,

Mike: 1:20:22

So let me,

Omar: 1:20:23

yeah, go ahead.

Mike: 1:20:23

down to you Omar. So, so many people follow me in the world. And they looked up to me, okay, the street people, man, you wouldn't believe that people just watch me. And this is why this is what we talked about in, in, in Bible class about the burden, the burden of being, being a disciple of Christ. I understand it because, um, now individuals that are watching me like, what? Man, local, and they're not, now they're calling me Michael, they changed, they're not respecting it, call me Michael, they're not bringing the folly around, man, don't you know, brother, my, I have an ex girlfriend, uh, she was, uh, dealing methamphetamines, Latin queen in Chicago, you know what I'm saying, and everything, man, she dropped all that, just out watching, like, and now is talking about Jesus Christ. The, She's not the only one there is another brother that he's showing up to church now You know i'm saying in imperial gates and I did a lot of time with uh showing up to church man Like these individuals are now dropping their pistols dropping their drugs dropping and now following the path because They they are seeing That a man, this, this, this guy right here, this loco is changing his life and the things that are happening with him. And I see, I see the difference. I want what he's got and it is not drugs. It's not drugs. It's not drugs that he's doing. It's jesus christ that he's doing and and now they are now people are following now people are Man, i'm witnessing it. I'm witnessing it and i'm i'm I'm amazed and it keeps me driving. It keeps me going every day. It keeps me in obedience. It keeps me surrendering. It keeps me not ever having a big head because I can never, I can never, ever, ever, ever say that this was me that did this

Omar: 1:22:32

That's right.

Mike: 1:22:34

wasn't me, me cut my arms up. Me put myself in a penitentiary. Me caused all these. Problems in the world. Like all these families ripped apart. Me cause a lot of pain and hurt Jesus Christ. He's he's where he's taken all that. And now he's bringing people to him. And I'm just like, in, in that I stay obedient because he's the one that's, he's the, he's the general,

Omar: 1:23:04

Amen.

Mike: 1:23:04

he's the general,

Omar: 1:23:06

just soldiering

Mike: 1:23:07

just soldiering up.

Omar: 1:23:08

Amen. Hallelujah.

Mike: 1:23:10

So I'm, I'm grateful for every day. You know what I'm saying? I'm, I'm, if anybody knows Nikki gracious, that's my, like my best homie. He's every day, Brian T's family, every, like, these are individuals that I'm telling you, like, pay attention, pay attention, people pay attention to all of folly. They spend all the time chasing the bag or a female on the streets or standing outside in the cold trying to serve But give him give some time to Jesus give some time to Jesus give some time paying attention to the individuals that He's changed because he doesn't want no one's good. There ain't no good in us He wants to take all the bad And reform it to give him the grace and the glory.

Omar: 1:24:01

That's right. Man, we're just uh, um, like uh, what do you call it? Like clay vessels, man, that we're nothing. Without him filling us man, and uh, that's why I told people kind of the same thing man They're the only good in me is him like there's nothing good in me You know I'm saying like uh, I'll be doing a prison ministry and my wife asked me Uh, man, do you love the guys that you go to witness to? And I thought about it for a second, like, honestly, I can't say that I love him, but I know who does. It is the father's love in me. Cause I know me, you know what I'm saying? Like I could be selfish at times, you know, I could be comfortable at home, you know, spending time with my wife and kids, but I know where God is desiring me to send me. To, to witness to these men behind bars that, you know, man, like I was there. I know, I know how that feels. So for me to say, I love my wife's. I was just like, man, but you know, part of you has to love them, but I know it's the father's love. You know, it's like, is it his love that compels me to do what I do now? You know what I'm saying? His love that compels me to, to do this, to help share stories, man. Cause it's. It's his love, like the Bible says, I believe this in first John, like we love because he first loved us. Once you realize, man, the father's love and then what Jesus did, that kind of love can't help but to love and then to, to give it back.

Mike: 1:25:23

Like, like, uh, like I said, I didn't know what love, you know, a lot of times people base love on an emotion, how they feel. But love is an action word Believing is an action word Faith is an action word. You know I'm saying these are action words like Loving is an action word. You can't just people throw that around all the time. I love you And I don't that's just a saying to a lot of people but that there's action that's required behind that There's sacrifice and there's love That requires behind it, like, like it says in the Bible, there's no greater love than to lay down your life for your brother. You know what I'm saying? Like, and that's, that's the type of preparation that, that, uh, um, we used to do on the streets. Laying your life down for your homie. Well, it's the same thing, but now for Jesus Christ

Omar: 1:26:24

Amen.

Mike: 1:26:25

now for Jesus Christ, I have no problem now. So he's taking soldiers that used to be in the street and making soldiers for his kingdom. And man, I am, I'm going to be a part of that. I'm not going to be on the sidelines watching it. I want to be in it. I'm a front linesman. You know what I'm saying? Battle ready. So I'm just grateful, man. Oh, mom, grateful for everything.

Omar: 1:26:51

brother, man, that's great story, man. Great testimony. And what God's is obvious, man, what God's doing, the transformation, may he continue to do it. You know what, is there anything else that you want to share? Maybe something we didn't get a chance to touch on, maybe anything on your heart, you know, you want to say maybe to those that are listening to your story.

Mike: 1:27:10

One thing, and, and, and this, this kind of tickles me a little bit. Um, when I, when I get, when I got saved in 2005, uh, I watched Passion of the Christ for the first time on Christmas. I couldn't stop bawling. Okay. I could not stop bawling. I'm inside the penitentiary. Now, when my homeboy, Angel Casares, when he passed away, I tattooed a teardrop because I refused to cry at a penitentiary. I'm not crying. When Julio Carina passed away, I tattooed a teardrop'cause I refused to cry. So when that happened, fast forward to the passion of the Christ. God told me, he said, man, every time the Holy Spirit dwells within you, you're gonna, you're gonna cry now since you wanted a tattoo teardrops on your face. Tough guy. So now, every time when the Holy Spirit dwells within you, you're gonna be crying and I can't. Now I can't stop it. Every time I feel the Holy Spirit in me, I, it, it consumes me and I cannot stop it. So I embrace it as Paul's thorn in the side. And he was like, my grace is sufficient enough. When Paul was like, they, can you take, can you help me out here? So I'm like, Lord, can you, man, it's embarrassing. Kind of crying all the time, man. You know what I'm saying? I was supposed to be, no, my grace is sufficient. You know what I'm saying? Every time that the Holy spirit, you teardrops on your face, like a tough guy. Okay. You going to be tough. Every time the Holy spirit comes, you going to know because you going to be balling.

Omar: 1:28:53

but you know what? Can I, can I say this, man? That's also God using you to lead by example, because there's a lot of men that are bound by that mentality where a men don't cry. And they've been told this as little kids and here they are with all this trauma and all this pain, but they're just holding it in, but there's healing. I believe healing comes, man. When you finally release, shed them tears for, there was a guy that was on the podcast, uh, Marine, uh, law enforcement. He said that, uh, some of his buddies, uh, uh, he heard one of his buddies took his life, suicide, another guy. He said he wouldn't cry. Uh, finally, uh, one of his close friends took his life and he, he couldn't cry. He was mad. Cause he said. As a Marine law enforcement, we're tough guys. Like we don't do this. And he became physically ill and going to all type of doctors, going to all type of everything and nothing, nothing. He said he kept, uh, getting weak physically, just didn't know what it was. So finally it was revealed to him. You're not mourning. You're not crying. You know, you're talking about those. Tattoo teardrops as a tough Marine. He, he couldn't, it wasn't until he got to that point, that revelation where, man, you haven't mourned. You haven't cried for your fellow brothers that you lost. And that's where he experienced healing, man. So I believe this man needs to see. A real

Mike: 1:30:20

Yeah. Yeah

Omar: 1:30:21

Cry. You understand what I'm saying? Yeah. It's not a sign of weakness. So, I believe even that is God using you. I know you called it a thorn in the side. Yeah. Man, I believe God wants people to see you. Hey man, it's okay to cry

Mike: 1:30:33

Yeah,

Omar: 1:30:34

as a man,

Mike: 1:30:34

absolutely. Absolutely. And, and, uh, you can call it what you, if you want to consider it, all the street cred, whatever you want to call the street cred, well, I've got boatloads of it and you're going to see this man right here sharing true feelings now. You know what I'm saying? Really experienced in love, really shedding the tears, really showing people like, Hey. God is real. God is real. If you don't think that God is real, let me tell you something. Watch, just pay attention, pay attention to the individuals. It's lives are changing. Pay attention, pay attention. I promise I beg you. I beg you because I, I want this for everybody. I want this for everybody, man. I genuinely do. That's, that's the difference with my heart. Now. Is back then, back then I couldn't care about any, any of that. Now I want this for you. Like, I want you to, I listen, I want to work with law enforcement. I want to work side by side with y'all and try to reach out to help some people that's struggling. I never had that desire before. I don't, I'm not talking about no, I don't want to arrest nobody or nothing like that. I'm talking about, I want to reach out to some people that are struggling, man, and say, hey, listen, man, the police officers, they're not bad like that, man. You know what I'm saying? They're not all bad. Like, don't get that twisted, man. These people are, they're not all bad. First responders, ambulance, medics, police officers, like they're really there to try to help. You know what I'm saying? Like if it wasn't for them, like it'd be straight chaos. There would be people like me running around just doing whatever. I'm telling you, like your heart changes.

Omar: 1:32:34

Yeah. You, you know, I'm glad you shared that about working with the police officer, the, the podcast I just released a podcast, think this, this weekend. And it was a former, uh, a, a PO man police officer, uh, 31 years Chicago Police Officer. Uh, 33 years between Marines and the army. And, uh, you know what, real quick, I'm going to grab my phone because you bring up a good point, man. Uh, I released a video on, on YouTube, you know, like the full interview, but I, I want to share this comment that somebody posted, you know, because, uh, I think it ties in like to, to what you're talking about, man. I want to share this. So, so somebody listened to this former police officer share his story, you know, and then, and this is what he put. This is the comment, the guy put. He put thank you to this man for sharing his story. I grew up on the opposite side of the law, but felt so many of the same pains and emotions as he did. I sat in the cells for years broken, thirsty to listen to someone like him speak. This is very filling of the soul

Mike: 1:33:40

man.

Omar: 1:33:42

Because this, this man shared his heart. Sure. This, um, personal and professional struggles. And when it's all said and done, We're all men, we're all human, man. We all go through the same issues, man. Like same, similar traumas, but we just end up in two different sides of the law and it just gives you an understanding, you know, like for them. So for this guy to, to, to post that and like, man, they really, they, they need to hear that, you know, like that we could work together. So this is the, I'm, I'm there with you, man. Like I go to, To Cook County Prison to, to minister, some are former, uh, law enforcement.

Mike: 1:34:23

Yeah.

Omar: 1:34:24

So you got former criminals, you could say, you know, law enforcement, but we're all there doing the same work, basically on the same side for the Lord. You know what I'm saying?

Mike: 1:34:33

Yeah. So, so, uh, my point is when you accept Jesus Christ in your life, when you truly do, when you surrender, your heart changes, you start viewing things differently.

Omar: 1:34:47

you

Mike: 1:34:48

You know what I'm saying? Like you don't longer have, like you have a choice, but when you truly surrender, know what I'm saying? Like you just go with it, go with it. Because there's so much, uh, everything that, that, that you're used to doing, drinking and smoking and everything, try to fill them voids. Oh, that is filled. When you accept Jesus Christ.

Omar: 1:35:15

Amen amen brother, you know what? With that, with that, can you close us out in a prayer, brother? Maybe pray, you know, whatever God pleases on your heart, you know.

Mike: 1:35:24

Father God, me and Omar come here tonight and thank you, Lord, for this opportunity, because I would never have this opportunity if I didn't turn my eyes and my heart towards you, Jesus. I just want to thank you for. The people that are watching father that that their interests are of you That just reaches out to somebody and help somebody lord because it's been so many times that We do the wrong things that I have done the wrong things lord I want to do something to help out and I just want to thank you for that opportunity lord I want to bless omar With safe travels in his traveling mercies, Lord. I want to put a hedge of protection for all the women, all the children, all the men, all the disciples of Jesus, Lord, and just guide us, guide us. Holy spirit convict us in every way that, that, that went, that. We come off track that you put us back on track and in Jesus name in holy Jesus's name I thank you for what he did in his life To show us how to love to show us how to think to show us how to walk To show us how to sacrifice to show us how to forgive. I want to thank you for showing us that I want to thank You for what you did on your cross just sacrifice Just exemplified. Lord, we should always be willing to sacrifice for the next man. And I just want to thank you for your son. I want to thank you for the Holy Spirit. I want to thank you, Father, for everything that you were doing in everybody's life that serve you and that you give everyone the opportunities to come to you, Lord. And I just want somebody to see this Lord and maybe put their sights on you, Jesus. In Jesus name, I pray.

Omar: 1:37:13

Amen. Amen Brother man. Thank you for man sharing your story with us. Man, uh, thank God for this divine connection, man. Shout out to a pastor, Daniel Rivera out here, uh, restoration house. You know, I tried to write a little something on the board over here, but they're out here and, uh, Gary, Indiana, obviously, as you could tell, doing amazing work, helping men, you know, get back on their feet, get back, reestablish to society, But more importantly be restored back unto the lord, you know back to our heavenly father Through our lord and savior jesus christ. I will definitely put us some links up to as far as uh the house I'm sure maybe there's a way that they could donate and contribute to the work that's happening here, you know

Mike: 1:37:53

be awesome

Omar: 1:37:54

Yeah, so we'll put that on there and uh, god willing i'm gonna get pastor dan to share his story as well one day You know, so I know he said he wanted me to come out here and get your story out there first Uh, and i'm glad I did man. I was blessed by this conversation And I know this conversation is gonna bless many man Uh, oh, no, it will brother. Trust me. It's blessed me as i'm sitting here and I know many men Women, families need to hear a lot of the stuff you shared, man, the ripple effect, you know, like you mentioned, it could have, it could be negative, but at the same way,

Mike: 1:38:25

can be

Omar: 1:38:26

once God grabs a hold of us, watch out, you know, make an impact for, for, for the kingdom, you know, uh, all in Jesus name, man. So with that. Uh, we're going to get ready to wrap up. I want to thank my, my guest, Mike, for being on here. Uh, Matthew 4, 16 reads, the people who sat in darkness have seen a great light and upon those who sat in the region and shadow of death, light has dawned alongside my brother, Mike. My name's Omar Calvillo. We are wrong to strong.